He was soft on them! Maybe he’s afraid to say what he really thinks because of what the backlash will be. I think hosting an advice giving show of any kind would be incredibly difficult right now. I do not envy that task. The already established people are sort of allowed to be bold and brash but his audience is younger and much more sensitive to criticism or perceived judgment of any kind. He has to walk such a fine line. This episode was the first time I felt it so strongly though, like that he was working overtime to say the right thing and be positive. It’ll be interesting to see how it progresses over time! It’s also possible he just believed her at face value a la, “she said she won’t drink anymore and poured the bottle down the drain right in front of me so it’s true!” to use another boozy metaphor.
Based on the transcript and the wellness vibes etc… I think her business is probably some kind of manifestation coach? Wellness manifestation coach
Let me see if I can figure out columns and then we can figure it out. I can’t. So I did a poll and hopefully we still get to a meaningful business
Choose one of each:
- Manifestation
- Abundance
- Wellness
- Lifestyle
- Coach
- Influencer
- Intuition
- Divine
- Wealth
- Dream life
- Rich life
- Purpose
- metamorphosis
- Path
- Crow
- Spirit
- Natural
- Healing
- Future
- Deserve
0 voters
There is another similar joke, but I fear too many people actually try it for real, rather than getting the meaning behind the story.
Funny story, when I was just out of university a subway token was $2. So I had a game with myself that if I walked home from work 3 times a week (a 60 minute walk on an unpleasant run of road) I could buy a Cash For Life scratch-off for $4.
So you’re saying my youtube channel name should be Plainjane’s Path to Purpose?
Excellent alliteration! And you don’t even have to manifest money because you already did via years of corporate work
I want to be a crow influencer now.
I just realized that Charlotte’s interpretation of this story could be that God manifested Alex to take care of her 
Oh, even I’ve heard that one! Goodness yes this is a thing people really do. 
Oh no 
you’re probably right
I just listened to the latest episode, Sarah and Andrew.
The part that surprised me the most
Was in the follow-up email, and not the part that Ramit read aloud. From Andrew:
The other thing that surprised me was I didn’t realize how much Sarah was affected by our conversation. We’ve had arguments before around money, but I felt that the day after our call, she didn’t speak to me. I gave her space, and as I write this we’re doing well. I suppose she’s a work in progress as well.
Sarah didn’t talk much during the podcast, and it strikes me that after the podcast, they are not communicating together or on the same team. She’s not talking at all, and he’s walking on eggshells around her. It doesn’t sound like they are working on a plan together. A penny for her thoughts. Did she get some new information about him / the relationship? What is it that she’s not talking about it with him? Is she thinking of / planning on leaving him? Angry that he listened to Ramit and not her?
The comments she makes to him about money sounded similar to the things that his dad said, and it made me wonder if he’s made that connection.
There was no follow-up email from Sarah. I think Ramit was right that neither one of them seemed to have skin in the game. I don’t think she got what she was hoping to get from going on the show.
I’m really curious to hear other people’s take.
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Live React Episode 45
Intro, swelling music, man talking who sounds super emotional/near tears. Ah, that must be Andrew. Andrew and Sarah are the couple. Sarah makes $85k a year, late 20s, and only $10k debt. Andrew is early 30s, makes $75k a year, has $65k debt. Cohabitating but nobody put a ring on it. Sarah wants to travel, Andrew says no bc of his debt, she feels stuck because he always says no. She’s getting judgmental (says Ramit) about how Andrew spends his money. Ramit says the real story is a lot deeper.
Ramit is asking Andrew about a recent disagreement he and Sarah had about going to Hawaii. Andrew’s going to talk us through what that was like. Sarah brought up going to HI because ticket prices were good. He said right away he thought “oh man here we go again”, because she also brought this up like 6 months prior as well as a year prior. He says every time they’ve talked about it he felt like the bad guy because he shot down her idea. He says he’s not ready financially and that whenever he says that he can see her demeanor shift and she looks sour. Like, “what’s the point” kind of expression. He feels like a burden because they can’t go. The outcome was they did not go to Hawaii.
Now Ramit is asking for Sarah’s take and how she felt. EQUALITY. She says the deal was great, roundtrip for $800 for 2 people, so she was like “well our last major trip was over a year ago, surely he saved at least $2k or so since then”. I love when people act like only traveling on an epic vacation once a year, or even every couple of years, is like…not a lot. LOL. She said he was stepping on eggshells and being indirect right away saying stuff like, “I need to check my account/I need to see if I have enough money/I need to look at my schedule. etc.” She felt like he was trying to delay things since these deals are time limited, which if true is hella passive aggressive and, IMO weak sauce.
Ramit asks her if she thinks Andrew can afford something like a trip to HI. She says she thinks he can afford it if were more disciplined with his finances. Ramit’s asking Andrew the same question, and he says, “I feel like I don’t,” which I think means no. He’s talking about his debt hanging over his head and how it makes him not want to spend anything. The way his savings and deductions work are based on Ramit’s rules (brownie points #1) and he says it’s working but it’s a slow progression. He feels overwhelmed every time they talk because he feels like he needs to pay off his debt.
Ramit is talking at us about what affording something means. It’s all perspective, emotions, not numbers, etc. Sometimes we can’t all agree on what we can afford, etc. Can you afford things if you still have debt? Does the type of debt matter? That kind of shit. Get it? Got it? Good. (00s reference deployed perfectly, +3 for AllVonDutch Hat).
Ramit says in Andrew’s case, he has $112k in investments (he’s 32) despite his debt. He asks Andrew how he feels about his investments. Andrew says he doesn’t check them much, maybe twice a year, just like Ramit suggests. Ramit is shamelessly plugging his book and references that it will even work for “left handed Eskimos” which is maybe not a great turn of phrase in 2022 but pobody’s nerfect. Ramit asks how he feels about income/debt. Andrew says he could have paid off his debt when he was living at home but because of things he was paying for for his family he didn’t. He says if he didn’t pay stuff off for them he wouldn’t be in this situation. Ramit wants more info, as do I.
Andrew’s dad filed for bankruptcy. His stepmom still works, she’s a nurse, IDK how relevant this is I’m just typing. He has younger brothers who started college, their vehicles, etc. Not enough to pay for everything so when Andrew graduated and started working he picked up the slack. He says he was sending almost 75% of his paycheck right out of school, and he was making like $1800 every two weeks). Ramit’s asking why the dad declared bankruptcy
His dad ran into trouble with debt, credit card debt, he doesn’t know the details. He couldn’t make minimum payments. He’s no longer in touch with the dad, but he’s still alive, it’s an unrelated reason tho. Ramit asks if he lived above his means, Andrew says yes and he spent a lot on acquiring things. Dudes be shopping, amirite? His Dad’s dream was prosperity (got them lots of toys, etc.) bc dad was from Philippines so American dream, etc. Ramit asks what rubbed off on Andrew. He says he mirrored his spending habits. He likes nice stuff. I LIKE SHITTY STUFF. HAVE YOU EVER HAD THE NACHO CHEESE THEY SERVE AT MOVIE THEATRES? Delicious.
Ramit wants to know what he bought. Clothes. Supplements. Athletic greens, which sounds like a weird political party/gym hybrid. I’ll join if I can wear leggings as pants. Ramit is accurately guessing what he takes, Andrew is laughing. He seems good natured about it. He says he spent like $250 A MONTH on supplements. Ramit says look at Sarah’s face. She asks if she can swear. She says, “What the fuck?” Haha, these two are wacky and funny. We’re talking about other stuff that money could have gone towards.
Ramit’s talking at us about how “some people” (us) call him out on being hypocritical on his standards for RICH LIFE. He says it’s not hypocritical, RICH LIFE must be something you can afford. It can’t just be whatever the hell we want. Ramit wants us to critically evaluate our RICH LIFE using our Affordability Lens. LensCrafters lawsuit is incoming. Do we think Andrew can afford a trip with Sarah? We are being asked. ANSWER PEONS .
Ramit wants to know how he got all the credit card debt. Automatic deductions like bills, he says. BULLSHIT. Supplements he says. WHAT ELSE? Everyday stuff, gas, and also…if…going out to eat. I think the truth is he doesn’t know where its gone. Ramit’s pressing him. Stuff he bought for himself, workout gear, jujitsu courses for $6k a year which he paid all at once with a loan? IDK what this dude is doing, lol. After he told Sarah about that they had an argument. Uh, yeah, lol…I bet. She offered to loan him the money or something? IDK. Ramit’s asking more about this course. He wants to get out of the hospital environment for work.
Ok, sidenote time. Come over here. Closer. That’s too close, you perv. But here’s something I notice about this guy. He’s a little sketchy. Like, he really evades answering questions. A. Lot. Ramit is having to pull every little detail out like teeth and IDK if that’s coming through in this recap because I’m compressing things. But it’s like the equivalent of this:
Ramit: So what did you do at work today?
Andrew: Oh, I worked on some different types of things. For work.
Ramit: Right, but what do you do?
Andrew: Well I use transportation to get to a work place where I’m paid to do work by my boss as well as other superiors.
Ramit: Ok, like WHAT FIELD do you work in?
Andrew: There’s no field near where I work but I like fields.
It’s like that. He’s either a poor conversationalist or he’s being purposefully evasive and manipulative. It is odd. We are still trying to ascertain what this stupid course is and what his future career plan is. Talking with this guy would make me absolutely mental. That’s how flummoxed I am; I had to borrow slang from the UK.
He is trying to find a new avenue of work. This course could potentially do that.
Sarah’s busting in now. She says she’s currently saving 40% of her income just to put a downpayment on a house. She sounds DONE with Andrew and like she’s sick of taking care of everything. At one point, she says, she was paying most of the rent. there are days where she doesn’t see him as her equal because she is the provider/breadwinner. He is kind of dragging her down, she says. She sounds like one second from dropping his little ass like it’s a hot potato. God I love potatoes. Nature’s bread.
Andrew says this is the part that makes him feel triggered and it hurts. That’s usually what gets said in these conversations, he says. That it’s his fault they can’t live the good life. Ramit asks what his reaction is, and he says he’s crying on the inside. This is weird tho, he doesn’t actually sound upset at all? He has at other points but not rn. He says he mostly feels it’s unfair, “how it happened” I think he means getting into debt. OWN YOUR MISTAKES, SON. He feels like the last decade of his life, it wasn’t his fault, so it makes him sad and upset. I think he feels like he’s owed. Maybe he should have left home sooner? And just taken care of himself? NOW he sounds upset, saying that. Ramit asks how long he lived at home. He says until he was 27. So he’s been out for 5 years…why is the debt not gone? If she can save 40% of her income that seems feasible to me but whatever.
His family didn’t like Sarah (bc she’s not Filipino and people be racist) so he basically went from the family home into living with her. Ramit’s asking what has happened the last 5 years with his debt. He says he doesn’t like feeling like a burden (another question dodge) and that he likes to pay for dinner or pay for an outing, he likes to do that. HE’s really trying to make it sound like he spends all of his money on other people. X. Something is sus. We’re talking about what being a man means. He gives the typical answer, breadwinner, responsibility, peeing in snow, etc. Dad told him to be successful, etc. It’s pretty normal not intense stuff IMO, I mean gender roles stuff but like, nothing extreme.
Nowadays Andrew feels like if you put in effort and work hard you can reach your goal. IDK what he’s talking about. Now he says it “hurts inside” that he had to hear this stuff at 5 or 6. Ramit rightly points out that he sounded really angry describing this. I agree. Ramit is being super sympathetic, saying it makes sense for him to be mad that his dad, who gave him money advice as a kid then going bankrupt and them him (Andrew) having to save the day. Andrew tried to talk to him about this but he pulled rank, old school dad style, “you wouldn’t be here if not for me.” Andrew says this still hurts inside, he sounds close to tears. It’s all wrong what his dad said. He feels like he realized this too late. This guy needs therapy to address allll of this stuff. He’s super emotional about all of this still. That is not snark. That is my professional unpaid internet commentator opinion. I’m also an unlicensed plumber, btw. And so are you!
Ramit asks Sarah how she feels being the higher earner. She says it feels nice to have extra money but that she has to delegate some of her money to help him out. Ramit says it doesn’t sound like she has a gender roles issue for her, she agrees- no issue there but she is worried about if they have kids. She wouldn’t want to work as much, so she’d need him to step up. She basically doesn’t trust him to be a co-pilot, let alone steer the ship on his own for a while, bc she feels like his mommy. That’s my read on it.
Ramit asks if they’ve talked about expectations around kids. Andrew nods yes as Sarah shakes her head no. I’m telling you guys, something is up with him…Ramit laughs at this difference. Andrew clarifies that they talked about having kids but not the expectations around that. Ramit’s trying to ascertain what they want. She says she’d want to work a reduced workload, take some time off, and then go back to work at a permanently reduced workload. Ramit asks if they’d be able to make it if her income were halved. She says assuming there are no debts…girl, you know there are, but yes in that case. She says because she aggressively saved. She says she has over a year’s worth of savings. IMO she doesn’t respect him. She doesn’t trust him. She needs to move on because that dynamic is the kiss of death 100%. And if she thinks she’s parenting him a lot now? Just wait until there’s an actual child in tow too. She will have to instruct him on Every. Little. Fucking. Thing.
Ramit’s asking about their conscious spending plan, which I guess is from his book. Andrew says he feels like when he looks at it all it makes sense in his head but then when it comes up in conversation he spirals and feels like his plan is at risk? I think? He gets choked up, nervous, anxious, whenever. WOAH. He says when they talk about spending, like on a trip, he feels like his DAD his standing right there over his shoulder telling him the awful things he said to him as a kid, like that money doesn’t grow on trees, and you need to be able to take care of your family, which you can’t do if you work at McDonald’s. There’s a presence of him looming over as they talk about money, Andrew says.
Ramit says he can help Andrew get rid of this. I…think you might be overestimating yourself, Ramit. This dude is in his 30s and can’t have a conversation about taking a vacation without feeling his father looming in the room with him. That’s…pretty fucking intense brah. Something else is clearly going on with this guy’s relationship with his dad. Ramit is like, you have smudged lenses with your dad’s fingerprints all over them. BUT IS THERE MITOCHONDRIAL DNA??? Sorry, I watch a lot of true crime.
We’re doing the stupid picturing different characters on each shoulder. Does this work for any adult human? On one shoulder is his dad. On the other shoulder is someone he admires when it comes to money. He says Sarah gives him good advice about money. Ramit says it can’t be Sarah on his shoulder (I told you she was his mom), she tells him if he doesn’t need something he shouldn’t buy it. She tells him not to get her anything extravagant for a gift. She doesn’t want him spending a lot of money. Ramit asks if he’s bought her anything fancy. He says a trip to Vegas early when they started dating. Ramit asks why he doesn’t take her advice if he thinks it’s good advice. He literally says, “I feel like it’s my dad talking to me.” Crispie cremes! This is bananas.
Ramit says HE will be the other guy on Andrew’s shoulder. He’s going to be directive, which Ramit says he isn’t usually, because this guy is seriously stuck bc he has shattered confidence. We’re back to the visualization. What does Lil’ Ramit say about Andrew’s finances? Andrew says Lil’ Ramit tells him he needs systems in place, have numbers, have a plan, and then like, uh, make sure, understand compound interest. Ramit asks what Lil’ Ramit says about his debt. “Pay your debts off? The debt snowball?” Our terrified hallucinating student answers.
Piano music. Andrew says he has to communicate with his partner. That Lil’ Ramit thinks he can do it. Ramit is like, just pep talking this guy. I wonder if Sarah has to do this pep talk shit for him all the time. I get the distinct sense she does. Andrew says now he feels emotional because no one believed in him as a kid. He’s choking up. Ramit says he believes in him. Sarah is notably silent. That means…something. Ramit asks if she believes in Andrew and she says, “yeah, 100%” in a chipper but tight voice. Ramit is praising him on how well he did saving for his investments even though he was taking care of his family. Andrew is full-on crying, he says he just wants to live his life to where he doesn’t have to worry about that (money, I think). It hurts, he says. He doesn’t know how else to explain it. Sarah is still silent. She might have left to make a sandwich or something, IDK.
Ramit is talking about becoming an adult and taking the best from your parents and leaving the rest. Ramit says he has a great relationship with Sarah. I mean…maybe? Who knows. He points out that with combined income they’re doing well, but there’s a ghost in the relationship. It’s Andrew’s father. Now Ramit is the ghost. Yes, really, lol. Ramit says ANDREW can choose whose advice he takes. But, sidetone, it would super piss me off if I were Sarah, giving him good advice which HE AGREED was good advice, and then he would not do it because it felt like his Dad. IDK man, that feels flimsy.
Ramit says he needs to focus on paying off cc debt, not just minimums. Debt payoff calculator online. Sarah is probably biting her tongue off. I am sure she has suggested this ten million times, lol. Ramit says Andrew still has a lot of money that is not accounted for, and it’s not all on supplements. YES, THIS. Andrew says until recently he had a car payment. It was a $37k car. Now it is paid off and he’s going to keep that car as long as he can. Ramit asks where that excess is going (from the car payments) he says he’s only had that for two months, and he also paid off a consolidated loan from a few years ago. So again, he doesn’t totally answer the question. I wonder if he’s lied about his debt, ever.
Ramit asks why he still doesn’t sound happy if he’s paying off all this stuff and making progress. He says he sounds like he’s been listening to emo all day in the rain, lol. It’s true, he sounds SO down. I think the truth here is that he is 10/10 pissed off and resentful about the family situation and all the money he spent on them and his dad issues. I wonder what amount it really was that he spent on his family, like was it really 75% of his income? And why does he not take any responsibility for this?
Andrew says now that he has this additional money that was from paying down the care he feels like he deserves to keep it for himself. Ramit goes, “what for more athletic greens?” Andrew laughs. The void opens wider. We are closer to the edge with each passing moment. Andrew says he feels more secure to keep his money. Ramit’s like ok keep some but pay off the fucking debt bro. The car payment was $472 a month, loan was $1k, and $1k rent. Ramit wants to know where the rest of the money went. Eating out, Andrew guesses that’s $50-$100 a month. No way, lol, I bet it’s more. Fun fact: I once helped a friend with finances, she gave me access to everything. She thought she spent $100 on restaurants a month. She actually spent $800 a month. Just eating out. That doesn’t count groceries.
Ramit chuckles but I can tell he knows something is up too. He says, “it seems like we’re still missing thousands of dollars here, about $1,500.” Ramit says, “basically what I’m telling you is you don’t know your numbers”. Without being competent you can’t be confident, says Tagline Generator Ramit 2000. Ramit says he’s spoken to couples with $800k of debt who sounded less down than these two sad sacks. He asks what they think about that. Andrew says it’s feelings. Sarah is still silent. It’s usually a good sign when someone goes totally silent. Right? Narrator: It’s not.
Ramit’s like you don’t even know what you spent on that credit card. But you also have to work on your money psychology at the same time as paying down debt. Two parallel tracks. RN we’re working on the plan. Ramit’s asking what we can do with the extra $1,500 and Andrew says pay down credit card. I don’t believe he’ll do it. Ramit asks how long Andrew thinks it will take to get rid of his debt and he correctly answers less than a year. See? This feels like evidence of fuckery to me. He knew how fast it would be to pay down.
Ramit is telling Andrew to choose his path, automate it, and talk to Sarah. He wants Andrew to go to Sarah with a financial proposal instead of just a bunch of his worries. He needs to take initiative. Ramit is telling him to do it now. Andrew says he’ll take the money he has leftover from his expenses that are deducted and pay it to the credit card and then hold off paying her the monthly grocery expenses until after the cc is paid off. Is that plan that sounds manageable, she asks? She says “yeah?” but IDK. It’s weird that he thinks he can’t even cover half of groceries in order to pay off debt.
Ramit says something is bothering him. NOT ENOUGH SKIN IN THE GAME. He says. They aren’t actually asking for her, Ramit says. They’re replaying old arguments but not putting themselves in the position to receive help, which puts him (Ramit) in the uncomfortable position of talking to two people who don’t want to hear it. He’s going to tell them this, he tells us. I kind of agree with his assessment here.
Ramit is telling them that he’s going to wait until they ask for help to assist them. Sarah immediately says, “what do you suggest we do?” Ramit is answering that they can take both of their loves and factor that into their RICH LIFE. Dates, road trip, planning when they will have a million dollars, future marriage plans, going through his wealth triggers plans. He wants them to be a team, basically, and to make money fun. He says their numbers are not that bad, but this is not a numbers problem.
Some people are just not compatible? That’s my takeaway.
Andrew says now that he understand his dad stuff and how that impacts him and his relationship that moving forward he’ll be able to catch himself in those moments. Why has Ramit not suggested them communicating via email, when it’s about money? That would probably alleviate a lot of his intensity in reaction and be more productive for both of them. Andrew says he wants to do this, etc. But like…he’s had 5 years and not done it. RAmit asks Sarah how she feels and she says, “yeah, we are in it together” but in an unconvincing tone. She says, “his problem affects both of us and we have to be a team”. She says she’ll always be there to support him. Yeah, that was glossed over wasn’t it? Like she has been financially supporting them all this time***. With all the money he is saving living with her covering things…like where is that money going? Andrew either doesn’t know and has a major consumption issue or he doesn’t want to say what he’s spending on because it’s embarrassing, like drinking or gambling or something.
She says once he pays off his debt he needs to buy her a ring. And she wants to talk about travel. Ramit agrees that would be super fun for them. Make money fun again, I guess.
THE END.
The follow up has Andrew saying he didn’t know how much his stuff with his dad was still affecting him but that he already did a bunch of therapy for his dad stuff and toxic family. This isn’t the first time his dad has come up in conversations, he says. Andrew’s put together a plan of paying $1,472 towards debt every month. But like…if his spending is partly to heal these emotional wounds, can he do it?
*** IN FACT, I just realized, if he moved home from 22-27 (as he said) to help his family financially, that is 5 years of helping. He then moved in with Sarah who started helping him financially, and he is 31, so she’s been helping him almost as long as he was helping his family (4 years for her, so far). It’s interesting how he ultra-focuses on the unfairness of him having to help his family but not on that side of things, that he’s also receiving a lot of financial help from Sarah- and for a long time as well.
WHAT DO YOU THINK, DEAR READERS?
Done like skinny jeans.
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I really didn’t know what to make of this one. Something felt…off about these two. Not sinister, just odd. And I don’t think I agreed with the tactics Ramit used. Eagerly awaiting your take!!
ETA: didn’t realize I had a few minutes left. The phrase “you don’t need a cupcake and you don’t need a clown car….” Does not compute.
More more!
I hate to disagree with our esteemed host, but 50s surely? (please tell me you know The Court Jester https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cysxO5Z-0L8 or the even more classic The Pellet with the Poison https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PotoHuLEJRY )
Yes!!! I also think Ramit is not doing a good job interviewing in this one. I’m paying way more attention to the construction of conversation now that interviewing will be part of my job. But wow it was hard to believe these two actually applied to be on the show.
yes, this is a hazard of the job, getting much more picky about bad interviewers in different media.
I think I was already picky, and what I’m learning will hopefully give me the language to understand why I like what I like and form an informed opinion. This is my hope, anyway!
This sounds cultural for the bloke. I remember we had a person from the Phillipines on another forum and their parents approach to money was a lot like the Dad’s, and really dude doesnt just need a therapist, he needs a therapist who is well aware of Phillipine culture and the whole spend up big/ also care for parents stuff.