Covid-19 discussion

Yeah I think health is seen as totally separate from disability by a lot of people. I think that might also be why able people who survive temporary medical issues will often argue with disabled people about the quality of medical treatment. Able people who become temporarily ill or injured are treated very differently than disabled people and often have really positive experiences, which they assume are universal.

Like if a young able person went to the doctor and told them they couldn’t move their neck at all, and the doctor examined them and found that they indeed couldn’t move their neck, the doctor would probably try to figure out why and be at least somewhat concerned. When that first started happening to me (at 25) the response was, “but you already have other mobility issues, right?” And I was like, “yeah but I’ve never had a problem with my neck before, and I have no hardware or curvature there, so it doesn’t make any sense” to which the reply was, “well yeah I understand that but you should be able to work around it since you’re used to working around other things! it’s probably all related!” No imaging was ordered, lol. There’s the expectation that you should just be able to deal with it if you already have stuff, because what’s one more thing? Your life already sucks! But someone with nothing wrong with them should be protected from discomfort at all costs.

So I think that bleeds into disability accommodation a lot. I think that’s why protecting healthy employees from covid seems reasonable. They must be protected from something dangerous that could permanently alter their very important quality of life! BUT allowing someone who’s had a stroke to work from home doesn’t make sense. Instead of working from home she should wear sunglasses in the office and lie down on the couch in the break room as needed, which would be about every 20 minutes, and would be totally humiliating because of course everyone would ask about it because it’s a fucking weird thing to do. But those were their real suggestions for her, they also offered that she could sit closer to the bathroom so vomiting and self-cathing would be “convenient”. Surely none of that humiliation and difficulty would impact her quality of life negatively, rather than say, just letting her work from home with minimal fuss. She should be able to handle that “compromise” and if she can’t she should just go on disability and have no career dreams whatsoever! What’s the difference? Her life already sucks!

This dynamic also showed through a lot in the people doctors refused to administer COVID treatments to because they claimed they already had “no quality of life”, which just means they were disabled.

ETA: Also I know you know a lot of this already @diapasoun <3 I’m just working through my shit here, lol.

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:heart::heart::heart::heart::heart::heart::heart::heart:

The suggestions that company had for your friend horrify me.

And one of the beautiful things about OMD, imo, is that it’s a good place to work through our shit.

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I spent my career helping people with disabilities return or enter the labor market working for the government yet when one of our employees needed a accommodation or to work remotely more than one day a week it was like pulling teeth and in the second instance never happened. It’s really sickening. Then society wonders why so many people with disabilities are unemployed or under employed and poor.

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They don’t wonder about this at all. We are invisible to them.

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Guess what! Danish entry restrictions for US citizens are changing 6 days before my flight to Denmark. :tada:

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On the plus side, free study time??

Looks like we can still go, actually! they moved the US to “orange” from “yellow” but that has pretty much no effect on vaccinated passengers from OECD countries.

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My county is still having 200+ new cases a day, but sure having 90,000 people pack themselves into the stadium for a football game with no masks or testing or vaccines required sounds great.

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One of the local high schools canceled the football game tonight, but only because 8 of the starting line have Covid and the quarterback is in ICU (no idea how he scored an ICU bed around here).

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Hate to say it, but probably because he is the quarterback?

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I’m supposed to visit what I think is your county for work “sometime soon.” I keep checking the numbers and quietly moving the trip date back in my mind.

(I have a lot of autonomy and my boss won’t push it, but I do actually want to go. Just… not yet, you know?)

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PM me if you want to chat about it. I can give you the lowdown.

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I’d agree except there’s no hospital in that county (it’s the high school for the county school system).

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One of my sister’s coworkers had a breakthrough case last week :frowning: My sister has tested negative ~6 days after exposure with no symptoms, thankfully, but her coworker feels really crappy. Cold symptoms, exhaustion, body aches, etc.

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One of my husband’s classmates’s husband died of covid on Saturday. He had just turned 30. Not vaxxed. His wife is absolutely devastated and is sharing his story in the hopes others will get vaxxed.

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I don’t have a NYT subscription, but I think this from the latest newsletter is valuable for perspective (copied in the event not everyone receives it).

Hidden for length

One in 5,000

The C.D.C. reported a terrifying fact in July: Vaccinated people with the Delta variant of the Covid virus carried roughly the same viral load in their noses and throats as unvaccinated people.

The news seemed to suggest that even the vaccinated were highly vulnerable to getting infected and passing the virus to others. Sure enough, stories about vaccinated people getting Covid — so-called breakthrough infections — were all around this summer: at a party in Provincetown, Mass.; among the Chicago Cubs; on Capitol Hill. Delta seemed as if it might be changing everything.

In recent weeks, however, more data has become available, and it suggests that the true picture is less alarming. Yes, Delta has increased the chances of getting Covid for almost everyone. But if you’re vaccinated, a Covid infection is still uncommon, and those high viral loads are not as worrisome as they initially sounded.

How small are the chances of the average vaccinated American contracting Covid? Probably about one in 5,000 per day, and even lower for people who take precautions or live in a highly vaccinated community.

Or maybe one in 10,000

The estimates here are based on statistics from three places that have reported detailed data on Covid infections by vaccination status: Utah; Virginia; and King County, which includes Seattle, in Washington state. All three are consistent with the idea that about one in 5,000 vaccinated Americans have tested positive for Covid each day in recent weeks.

The chances are surely higher in the places with the worst Covid outbreaks, like the Southeast. And in places with many fewer cases — like the Northeast, as well as the Chicago, Los Angeles and San Francisco areas — the chances are lower, probably less than 1 in 10,000. That’s what the Seattle data shows, for example. (These numbers don’t include undiagnosed cases, which are often so mild that people do not notice them and do not pass the virus to anyone else.)

Here’s one way to think about a one-in-10,000 daily chance: It would take more than three months for the combined risk to reach just 1 percent.

“There’s been a lot of miscommunication about what the risks really are to vaccinated people, and how vaccinated people should be thinking about their lives,” as Dr. Ashish Jha of Brown University told my colleague Tara Parker-Pope. (I recommend Tara’s recent Q. and A. on breakthrough infections.)

For the unvaccinated, of course, the chances of infection are far higher, as Dr. Jeffrey Duchin, the top public-health official in Seattle, has noted. Those chances have also risen much more since Delta began spreading:


Source: Washington State Department of Health

Another way to understand the situation is to compare each state’s vaccination rate with its recent daily Covid infection rate. The infection rates in the least vaccinated states are about four times as high as in the most vaccinated states:


Data as of Sept. 2; cases are the 7-day daily average.The New York Times

If the entire country had received shots at the same rate as the Northeast or California, the current Delta wave would be a small fraction of its current size. Delta is a problem. Vaccine hesitancy is a bigger problem.

The science, in brief

These numbers help show why the talking point about viral loads was problematic. It was one of those statements that managed to be both true and misleading. Even when the size of the viral loads are similar, the virus behaves differently in the noses and throats of the vaccinated and the unvaccinated.

In an unvaccinated person, a viral load is akin to an enemy army facing little resistance. In a vaccinated person, the human immune system launches a powerful response and tends to prevail quickly — often before the host body gets sick or infects others. That the viral loads were initially similar in size can end up being irrelevant.

I will confess to one bit of hesitation about walking you through the data on breakthrough infections: It’s not clear how much we should be worrying about them. For the vaccinated, Covid resembles the flu and usually a mild one. Society does not ground to a halt over the flu.

In Britain, many people have become comfortable with the current Covid risks. The vaccines make serious illness rare in adults, and the risks to young children are so low that Britain may never recommend that most receive the vaccine. Letting the virus continue to dominate life, on the other hand, has large costs.

“There’s a feeling that finally we can breathe; we can start trying to get back what we’ve lost,” Devi Sridhar, the head of the global public health program at the University of Edinburgh, told The Times.


Theater employees checking vaccination cards as people returned to Broadway last week.Jutharat Pinyodoonyachet for The New York Times

I know that many Americans feel differently. Our level of Covid anxiety is higher, especially in communities that lean to the left politically. And there is no “correct” response to Covid. Different people respond to risk differently.

But at least one part of the American anxiety does seem to have become disconnected from the facts in recent weeks: the effectiveness of the vaccines. In a new ABC News/Washington Post poll, nearly half of adults judged their “risk of getting sick from the coronavirus” as either moderate or high — even though 75 percent of adults have received at least one shot.

In reality, the risks of getting any version of the virus remain small for the vaccinated, and the risks of getting badly sick remain minuscule.

In Seattle on an average recent day, about one out of every one million vaccinated residents have been admitted to a hospital with Covid symptoms. That risk is so close to zero that the human mind can’t easily process it. My best attempt is to say that the Covid risks for most vaccinated people are of the same order of magnitude as risks that people unthinkingly accept every day, like riding in a vehicle.

The bottom line

Delta really has changed the course of the pandemic. It is far more contagious than earlier versions of the virus and calls for precautions that were not necessary a couple of months ago, like wearing masks in some indoor situations.

But even with Delta, the overall risks for the vaccinated remain extremely small. As Dr. Monica Gandhi, an infectious-disease specialist at the University of California, San Francisco, wrote on Friday, “The messaging over the last month in the U.S. has basically served to terrify the vaccinated and make unvaccinated eligible adults doubt the effectiveness of the vaccines.” Neither of those views is warranted.

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I also thought this was really good.

Rolled my eyes, of course, because the NYT did plenty of that messaging.

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Oh, for SURE.

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I don’t understand what this means?

ETA OH like you mean the very fear based messaging they’re decrying here?

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Yeah. Like, I’m glad they’re reporting more positive science as well… but they are definitely not without fault on the thing they’re criticizing. (And just aren’t admitting it explicitly, which I would have liked.)

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