Garden Chat

I potted up a cutting from the bed of mystery succulents left by previous owner. For work.
I’m not a big succulent guy but maybe I could be?



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Oh and I added these pink smiley face balls to these pothos. Sparked much joy for M when he spotted them.

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When you go looking for Cornichon seeds and you realise the Baker Creek seeds website is alternating blue and yellow plants on their front page in support of Ukraine.

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Awww. I love those tiny acts of care showing up all over the place.

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They also did a couple of days sale with all proceeds going to a charity helping Ukraine, forget which one.

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I think I started my squash waaaay too early

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Dumb question ahoy

@calbal

Is deer fencing different from hardware cloth? They look the same on image search,?

Do i need to do a raised bed?

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Yes, they are different. Hardware cloth is actually welded wire mesh of fairly small hole size (much of it is 1/4" - 1" ish). It isn’t cloth at all (I don’t know why they call it that) it is stiff and more akin to chicken wire but much better (and with smaller holes). Hardware cloth is often used either to line the bottom of garden beds (if you have big problems with like moles/voles) or dug down along the edges if you have things that will dig down to get into beds but you don’t quite need the Fort Knox level of protection that lining the bed completely would afford. (Also completely lining beds with hardware cloth is expensive.) Hardware cloth is also used to protect chickens in chicken coops from predators (chicken wire is crap for that, it only serves to keep chickens in but does not keep predators out).

Deer fencing is usually flexible plastic or nylon netting-type stuff. Deer fencing isn’t actually strong to keep deer out, it provides a visual barrier to the deer so that they think they cannot go in a place. Deer can jump quite high though, so if the garden is large you need quite tall deer fencing (like 8’ or greater) because if they can see a big enough space, they may try to jump something shorter. With small gardens, I think it’s ok to just have a shorter fence because they won’t see enough space to land, so won’t try to jump a shorter fence (by shorter I mean like 5-6’ maybe). YMMV of course.

If you are in a more urban-y area, you probably don’t need deer fencing because you are unlikely to have deer. You are more likely to have raccoons (who will climb any type of fence) and squirrels (ditto) as pests. Maybe chipmunks. You may also have digging pests also (moles/voles). Rabbits (like cottontails, not jackrabbits) can also jump up to 2’ on the regular. So you will likely need some kind of fencing to protect vegetable plants, maybe 3’ rabbit fencing*, and then if you find you have a lot of problems with squirrels and raccoons, add additional protection later. If you see a lot of digging, maybe also lay hardware cloth around the edge (dug down as far as you can manage, I only managed 9" below ground/15" above ground in the small garden I did last year - I did not have any digging rodent problems, I know they are around (I see their sign) but I don’t know if they would have necessarily attacked the garden.)

*rabbit fencing has closer hole spacing on bottom and larger up top.

I personally don’t think raised beds are necessary for most things but for some people and situations they are lifesavers! Like, if a person has mobility issues or issues bending or kneeling, they can still garden with tall raised beds comfortably! Or for purely design style! Of it there are tons of animal pests (especially digging/climbing pests), tall raised beds can help protect. Some plants are easier in raised beds (even short ones) like potatoes and root vegetables, because the soil is likely to be finer/less rocks, than in-ground, and probably fewer insect pests too (like grubs). If the soil is truly terrible and would take years of work to improve (like straight up glacial till with no actual soil, a house in a development where they’ve literally removed all the good topsoil and only left dirt, or very heavy clay), raised beds would get you started much more quickly and easily as well (as you work to improve your native soil!). But it will cost a lot in materials and soil, which is prohibitive for a lot of people. And I think in ground is easier with watering (ie you need to water much less frequently), even in the dry west, with the prodigious use of mulch. Mulch is a better watering solution in dry climates than using raised beds, raised beds drain and dry out much more quickly. My tomatoes in SLC in-ground (with heavy mulch) did better than the ones that were in the raised bed that I inherited there. (For mulch I used free wood chips.) It’s definitely situational dependent.

I think I maybe come across as anti-raised bed, but I’m not, I swear! I mostly I think they aren’t necessary for a lot of people in a lot of situations, and are pushed by a lot of outlets as a one size fits all solution (because it makes them a lot of money). :woman_shrugging: I will probably make some small raised beds in my new garden, at the low spot (where the groundwater table is high), but I will use found materials as borders (logs from fallen trees) and they won’t be very deep, maybe 6", and I might do them hugelkultur-style with sticks or logs at the very bottom if I can manage to make them deep enough. And cross my fingers. It’s an experiment this year!

End novel. I am very opinionated. :joy:

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I am very pro raised garden bed but that’s because I live in what used to be someone’s backyard and have found glass shards in my soil, plus soil here is often high in metals I don’t want in my food. It’s all about your local conditions!

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Oh for sure. Definitely if you suspect soil contamination as well. I would also not grow anything in ground (for consumption) immediately next to an old house because of lead based paint concerns, regardless if I had it tested or not.

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We tend to need to heavily amend here. We’re trying out raised beds this year, because our amending efforts gave not rendered soil that’s rich or loose enough. We’re doing drip irrigation at the same time, which we’re hoping will help with the water loss that tends to happen with raised.

It’s a lot of trial and error too. Also our raised beds are made of logs salvaged from our neighbor’s tree removal, so free materials.

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I am not sure this was meant for the garden thread :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

We have 3 lines of sprinklers that were set up by the previous owner. I swapped one set to drip line a month or two ago.

The second line runs the grass sprinklers, which are pop-ups. The original sprinklers were permanent risers. The originals have now all either been capped or swapped to pop-ups, and now the lawn is getting enough pressure to cover the whole lawn instead of half.

The third line, also originally permanent risers, is partly capped, partly risers and now, as of yesterday, runs drip-line along my backyard fruit trees! Very exciting, and I’m going to buy more drip-line.

:woman_facepalming: this is happening a lot lately.

How do I know when to start flower seeds? This is my first time trying. I don’t have a good place in my house that the cat won’t get into them, so I’m planning to do it in my garage which is not insulated. I’m in zone 5. I got a heat mat which I assume will help. I could lay the heat mat on a towel or blanket if that would be helpful too.

Depends a bit on when it stops getting to freezing temperatures in your area (which can vary within the same zone).

I would do maybe 6 weeks before you expect no-more frosts, which is often early-mid may for zone 5? Maybe 8 weeks for marigolds.

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I had the idea the other day to interplant carrots and beets among my garlic bed. (I love root veggies but don’t have a ton of space for them because I also love tomatoes and salads and flowers) I’m thinking of putting a seed in the center of a square of garlics, so it will be pretty sporadic.

My biggest concern is watering once it gets close to garlic harvesting time. I think I’ll kinda test proof of concept this year and if it works, I’ll space my garlic planting accordingly this fall.

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Do I want them large enough to plant right away once it’s warm enough? I would say it’s safe a bit before Memorial Day, so perhaps mid April to get them started? I do need to read the packets. Can I alternate start dates like every couple of weeks so that I have more continuous blooms for cutting?

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The packets should tell you how far in advance to start them, if they don’t, look up similar (or same) varieties on one of the big seed companies websites. I’m also in Zone 5, I am starting tomatoes, peppers, eggplants now, but likely won’t plant them out until end of May unless the forecast looks really really good. Eggplants are the most cold sensitive of those, then peppers, then tomatoes. Squash I may start soon, but only because I am trying something new this year and trying to get them really big before planting out (to try to avoid death by squash bugs) - I’ll also direct seed those though in May-ish. Things like cucumbers, beans, wait until the soil is very warm and direct sow, otherwise they will rot in the ground - if you want to start inside I would do cucumbers, but not beans. If your ground is no longer frozen and can be worked (probably is), you can direct sow peas right now. Any cool season or cold hardy crop you can start already (like kale, collards, cabbage, etc, probably spinach, etc - some of these you can direct sow also but also you can start ahead) as they are cold hardy and you can plant out pretty early. I have some spinach that started growing again after it overwintered! Flowers will have their own timings, you’ll have to look at the packets. Seed onions and leeks and celery should have already been started, they take a long time. If you want to grow sweet potatoes you need to start them immediately to hopefully get slips to then root and then plant out when it is very warm (it is a very long season tropical plant). Potatoes, carrots, direct seed when the soil is warmer (though carrots maybe soon? Not sure.) Radish you can direct seed soon, though they will be slow to grow at first. Herbs you can start already, but tender herbs like basil you might wait because they cannot withstand under ~50 degrees and it will be May/June until we are reliably there; things like cilantro, parsley are a lot more hardy. Definitely succession sow for continuous harvest (like you said, every few weeks)! If you have a way to protect plants (row covers, low tunnels, cold frames, walls of water) you can move everything back a bit. Zone 5 has an annoyingly late season start, at my place the historical last frost date is end of May. GOOD LUCK!! :smile:

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I’ve seen shorter term crops suggested for interplanting with garlic, like radish and lettuce.

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That’s a good idea. You’re right @krmit, needing to water may be a problem when nearing harvest time for the garlic.